Gary Harris Chooses MSU
by Purdue_Pete on Nov 9, 2011 7:53 PM EST
in Recruiting
Email
PrintI was 500 words deep into my heartwarming 'we shouldn't give up hope' post when the news finally broke.
We know the feeling all too well. Always the bridesmaid; never the bride.
After a fierce recruiting battle, Gary Harris has decided to take his talents to Michigan State University. To their credit, Tom Izzo recruited Harris the longest and built a very solid relationship that ultimately ended up sealing the deal.
Harris selected MSU over Purdue, Kentucky, and Indiana.
And as much as the decision stings, I hold no ill will towards Gary Harris or his family. They took their time, gathered all the necessary information and made a very informed decision. At the end of the day, all you can ask for is that a prospect gives Purdue an honest and equal look. Beyond that, it's up to the kid and his family to determine what's best for him. And if there is no denying that they made a very, very informed decision.
I understand there will be a grieving process among the Purdue fans and that it will inevitably manifest itself as doom and gloom comments, message board posts, and tweets. But keep in mind Purdue was lucky to do as well as they did in GH's recruitment considering they came so late to the table. Less than a year ago GH seemed like nothing but a pipe dream. However, Matt Painter never gave up and made a pretty big splash in the recruitment process. In my eyes, it was all found money. It was widely reported that it was a 50/50 tossup following his visit to MSU prior to his decision. That's something to be said considering the competition.
A Bright Future
The one thing that has gotten lost among all the Gary Harris noise the past 6 months is the spectacular class that signed today and they will be making an immediate impact next season.
The class of 2012 (Rapheal Davis, AJ Hammons, Ronnie Johnson, and Jay Simpson) is still one of Matt Painter's top classes with diverse talent and a lot of upside. They will join a talented team with an established culture and system that will ensure Purdue remains competitive well into the future. Assuming that they all develop at a natural pace, each of the 2012 class members have the potential to be All Big-Ten caliber players under coach Painter.
Beyond that, Painter is off to a great start for the class of 2013. Kendall Stephens, Bryson Scott, and Basil Smotherman are some of the best talents in the area and Matt Painter is likely not done for this class. Further, there are some very good prospects in the class of 2014 and beyond.
Matt Painter once said that: Nothing is ever as good or as bad as it seems.
Those words can be taken to heart. Painter sure as hell won't skip a beat in his recruiting strategy. Next man up.
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Crushing.
Purdue showcases yet again that it cannot land 5-star talent.
Soon
Whether its Willis or someone we haven’t heard of yet in 2013 or one of the many guys Painter is in early on in ’14 or ’15, Painter will get a 5 star eventually. Ok ,so maybe not as soon as we would like, but it will happen.
Doubt it
I’m a Purdue fan, but Painter needs to show some sustained success without his one fantastic class before he will woo five-stars away from Izzo, Calipari, Coach K, Roy, etc.
That period won’t even begin until next season since Hummel stuck around. So hopefully the 2012 class (which shook out very nicely surprisingly) will start that new era in his tenure well.
This comment...
It’s like clockwork…
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
Doesn't make it any less true
Not going to sit here and act like this doesn’t sting. It’s time for Purdue to start landing these types of players instead of simply being considered.
I like our 2012 class. It certainly is solid. But there’s no elite talent in this group. Harris would have been that type of talent and would have made this class really something special.
My thoughts exactly
Jay, Ronnie, AJ and Rapheal all have a ton of potential, but I think lack that elite talent to take over games and pose mismatches for other teams. We all saw the transformation the Baby Boilers made. Hopefully, Painter can do the same with the 12’ class. I just want to see what Painter could do with a 5 star talent if he’s done so well with 3 and 4 star guys…
Don't disagree
This sucks. But my point was we have a legit shot to get some elite talent like you described as soon as this time next year. We aren’t doomed to mediocrity forever because of one recruit.
Don't want to be a dick but...
A. MSU lands talent like Harris pretty regularly, doesn’t mean they are going to dominate, becuase MSU tends to underachieve given their talent level.
B. Our recruiting class is just decent. AJ is a good PG prospect, but not a great scorer. Jay has asthema, and there is no telling whether he will ever meet his potential. He is a project. Hammons could be great, but is also a project. Raphael is a great HS scorer, but doesn’t have a ton of upside.
C. Next year’s class is great. I hope we can add Willis, but I don’t have alot of hope right now.
umm..
A.) I am not sure you can say they under achieve given the number of Final 4’s they have been to lately.
B.) Your assessments of our class our very off base. Projects aren’t contributors for day one. Hammons, RJ, and Simpson will contribute from day 1. Rapheal Davis will be good for Purdue, no doubt about it.
C.) You should probably go take a walk or something to cool off.
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
Couple things...
A. Yes, but look at the talent they have been bringing in. Those FF runs were very unexpected. Aside from those somewhat surprising runs, Izzo’s teams have dissappointed over the course of the season. Just sayin’
B. How much will they contribute? My assessments are based off their recruiting rankings, which are just OK. Those rankings tend to overstate how good guys will be, and our rankings aren’t that great. I hope you are right. But you can’t deny that Simpson has serious aesthma, Hammons is somewhat low ranked for his size, and Davis’s game might not translate to the BT.
You have a rather high yardstick
So unless MSU a) have great regular season, b) goes to FF, and c) do it EVERY YEAR, then that won’t make them underachieve?
FWIW, I think Duke and UNC bring it more “talent” than MSU over the last decade by far. Over the last decade, they were regularly getting Top 10 players while MSU getting Top 50. Yet, in terms of post-season success Izzo is right up there.
(Look, I dislike Izzo but I can’t deny his success as a college coach. I so much wish he has gone to coach the Cavs…)
Regarding this:
A. Final Four runs in 99, 05 and 10 were unexpected. MSU was a number one seed in 00 and 01 and a number two in 09. This means they had an excellent regular season, leading to a higher ranked seed thus easing their road to the Final Four somewhat because they are expected to go there much more than say a 14 seed. Izzo has had three seasons I would call truly disappointing, last year, 06 when the Big Three couldn’t come through and 04 when they were extremely overrated after a surprise Sweet 16 run. That’s really not that bad when you consider that every time MSU “underachieves” they still make the tourney. If Purdue or Indiana or Minnesota underachieves this year they are NIT bound. Point being, if MSU is an UNDER-achieving school then nobody meets expectations except Duke and UNC.
B. I actually agree with you here. Raphael doesn’t hit me as a guy who will be playing solid minutes in crunch time as a senior. Simpson is a project. I do think Hammons and Johnson will make an impact right away but they certainly won’t star for a bit. Which really means that Boilers hope to hell that Terone and Kelsey and DJ can carry a team in 2012, cuz otherwise the ships sunk.
u could argue
MSU shouldnt have gotten in last year if not for beating Purdue in the BTT.
Meet Anthony Johnson my friend. Other players will emerge as well
"The goal remains the same"
by TimeToPlayHard on Nov 10, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
I think you are too reliant on rankings. Time will obviously tell, but seeing each of these guys play in person, I’ve seen the talents that these guy possess. Simpson has his asthma under control. This has been well documented. I am not sure which rankings you consider the ‘right’ ones, but Hammons low ranking is just as much of a function of of the people he’s playing with. He’s in his best shape of his life right now and his value will mainly be defense and rebounding. His offense (scoring) might be a work in progress, but his ability to rebound and feed the break and pass out of the post is steller. His defense is what is ultimately give him minutes.
I’ve seen Rapheal Davis play up in AAU events against some of the nation’s top athletes and he always rose to the occasion. There is no reason to think he won’t adjust to the college game.
You seem to really exaggerate the downsides of these players as deal breakers. But in all honestly, most teams in teh nation would love to have them.
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
by Purdue_Pete on Nov 10, 2011 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
Exactly
Thank you for knowing what you are talking about with these players instead of just saying how shitty they are cause of some ranking. This class is gonna be awesome
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
Hey BoilerHerm
Save that crappy pessimism, we don’t need it.
Remember, we got a 1st team AA out of a group with your definition of “no elite talent”.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 9, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
Nothing pessimistic about it
It’s reality. I don’t think you can classify our 2012 class as anything other than just solid at this point. The 2007 class had 4 in the top-75, with E’Twaun being a top-20 talent. This class has 3 in the top-100. At this point, the two aren’t comparable. Harris would have made that argument more compelling.
I hope I’m wrong but right now facts are facts.
Fair enough
But rankings aren’t the only thing that matters. Do you really believe there is a massive difference between the 50th and 80th ranked players in the nation? How could anyone possibly rank high school players in that specific of order. Imagine trying to rank college players from 1 to 100. It would be impossible to differentiate these players that much and they play on national TV all the time. Yes, there is a difference between top 20 and top 100 but our recruits being 80 instead of 55 isn’t something to worry about.
Butler?
They had one person on their team that was a top 100 recruit, matt howard, and they went to two final fours but clearly rankings are all that matter. Also who had etwaun ranked in the top 20 when we got him?
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
ESPN and Scout I believe.
It seems strange to think it, but Moore was an incredible recruit. He was easily one of the best prospects of that class, and his play at Purdue was obvious of that.
Just espn
All the other sites, which were way better than espn back then, had him as a top 40 recruit. All im saying is when there is that much disparity between sites who do the same thing then people should stop using these stupid rating in their arguments.
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
Butler's the exception, not the rule
I’m not saying it can’t happen, but history shows you get to FF’s with premium talent.
Well people said it
a few years ago. We started too late in his recruiting. This sucks. Hope he does well. Just not too well. Boiler Up! Still pumped about this class!
by PUrower on Nov 9, 2011 7:57 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Couldn't agree more...
A.J., Rapheal, Ronnie and Jay will really help build upon what we do this year… At least Gary made an informed decision and took his time… I still hope he goes 0for against us during his time @State!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 8:01 PM EST up reply actions
Hello? Dude was a DOUBLE LEGACY
His recruitment started the day he was born in West Lafayette IN.
Sr’s comments were telling. They went to MSU and felt the love. They dod not feel the love here. I wonder if Painter isn’t too hardcore for the kids and families? Does he rub people the wrong way or something? Or maybe there was some Purdue bad blood?
I’m sorry guys, but this kid was ripe for the taking.
Sr said he felt like part of the family at MSU.
Other schools just talk about family…seems like a dig at us if you ask me.
Wasn't there some kind of miscommunication during a visit to Purdue with Harris...
where someone who was leading him around had no clue who his mother was? It was at that point that I think we may have lost them… Also… not every player is made for our style of play. He may feel better suited with State’s style of ball?
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:39 PM EST up reply actions
Harris was also exactly what MSU needed position-wise.
We already have a lot in his position. Granted, he would have probably started/played a ton immediately, but the fact still remains.
We will be fine...
The four guys we brought in will all be very good for us… Yes, Harris would have added to that, but I think we will be just fine… and I hope to HELL we sweep Mich. State for however long Harris is there!
On a side note… we can now pursue Willis for 2013 even harder… no?
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 7:59 PM EST reply actions
We are full for 2013
Unless someone in 2013 goes to prep school, Sandi graduates, etc. It would have been the same situation as if we had landed Harris.
A lot to look forward to
but once again, we’re looking at mediocrity in our future. We will be good in the future, perhaps very good, but if we want to reach FF’s and win championships, we can’t keep missing out on these 5 star recruits. Harris’ parents were both Purdue alums, and we couldn’t land him. How much more of a tie can you get?
that is the part i found disappointing as well
Both parents Purdue alums, mom a bball player herself…and we still couldn’t close the deal in the end.
That said- I am still VERY VERY excited about our 2012 class, AND our 2013 class.
Go Boilers!!!
We will be fine
Let’s not forget Jay, Raphael, A.J., and Ronnie, who joined our family today. time to move forward with what we have instead of what we do not have.
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
HammerAndRails, SBNation's Boilermaker Blog
If Butler can make it to 2 NC game w/o any 5*
I don’t see any reason why we can’t with a bunch of 4* … as long as the ACL god stays away from us.
by charlespig on Nov 9, 2011 9:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Don't forget about VCU.
They didn’t seem to have too much trouble with us.
To Our New Boilers:
Well guys, you don’t have to worry about being overshadowed by a 5 star ‘elite’ player. It’s in YOUR hands to craft your own Boilermaker legacy.
Welcome to Purdue gentlemen. BOILER UP!!
"There's no hope until Hope is gone!"
by boilerslim on Nov 9, 2011 8:38 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Maggie Painter's (Coach Painter's Daughter) Tweet
I hope Gary Harris gets hit by a train. #irony #BTFU
That's not righ
Hopefully Matty teaches her here. Win with class. Lose with class.
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
HammerAndRails, SBNation's Boilermaker Blog
by BoilerTMill on Nov 9, 2011 8:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I hope she is being metaphorical...
Purdue being the train… I hope we run over him the next four years on the court!!! :D
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
helloooooooo
our mascot is a train…… he’ll have to play us now……
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe she knew how much Matt wanted Gary?
by PurdueEnginerd on Nov 9, 2011 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, must have been a close second the way that seems.
by Boiler_Ditsor on Nov 9, 2011 8:24 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sorry
that is trashy. Can’t even believe that’s really from her.
That's 100% from her.
99.99999% of her tweets are non-Purdue related. Mostly teenage girl stuff.
by Boiler_Ditsor on Nov 9, 2011 8:29 PM EST up reply actions
I dont want to be that guy, but...
why exactly are you following our coach’s 15 year old daughter?
Football recruiting guy for Hammer and Rails
Lead blogger for 5 other sites.
Follow the Twitter for all the details
Twitter: http://twitter.com/#!/Riles23
Twitter: http://twitter.com/#!/Big10RantPurdue
by HawkeyeBoiler on Nov 9, 2011 9:14 PM EST up reply actions
LOL
I’ve followed her since the Mizzou scare. That was how I knew some things before the whole world did.
by Boiler_Ditsor on Nov 9, 2011 9:16 PM EST up reply actions
everyone's thinkin' it.
you just asked it. :P
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:31 PM EST up reply actions
Doesn't he have younger brothers who play b-ball?
Maybe it would be best to not burn bridges before they are built…
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:42 PM EST up reply actions
She is now getting slammed by MSU fans.
Feel bad for her.
by Boiler_Ditsor on Nov 9, 2011 10:25 PM EST up reply actions
Well, that's a lesson to be learned
I’d never ever wish injury or “hit by a train” on anyone.
she should get slammed...
that is not something you say about someone who made a personal decision… it’s not like he made his decision just to screw us over… he thinks it is what is best for him… respect it!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 10:36 PM EST up reply actions
Read a little deeper
Maybe I’m giving her too much credit; but I’m assuming the train (mascot) she is referring to is Purdue.
by weasel cleaner on Nov 10, 2011 8:00 AM EST up reply actions
Even if that is true...
You can’t make a comment like that and not expect people to react.
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 10, 2011 5:53 PM EST up reply actions
Bright Side?
He didn’t choose IU. If we can’t have him, neither can they.
I was sad
For two seconds about his commitment to MSU. I think some of you are vastly underestimating the skills our incoming class has…#Motivation
by JFranchise on Nov 9, 2011 8:24 PM EST via mobile reply actions
It's a great class
But Gary Harris would have made it fantastic.
by Boiler_Ditsor on Nov 9, 2011 8:25 PM EST up reply actions
I think you
vastly underestimate the difference between a true 5* talent, and a 100-150 type player. Not saying the class isn’t good, and there is some players that have the opportunity to be solid B10 players. But there is a difference.
Agree 100%
See my post above.
Will Raphael be able to score in college? Remains to be seen. Jay has aesthma. AJH is a bit of project, but does have huge upside. And AJ is a good pointguard.
Who is AJ?
His name is RONNIE…
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:45 PM EST up reply actions
speaking of RJ
Painter said he’s one of those rare guys that makes everyone around him better. that’s a compliment reserved for very few players. hard to compare him to Robbie since he plays a different position, but that’s the kind of compliment you give a player like him. I like our chances with RJ around.
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
I hope he can make his bro better....
Could be an interesting dynamic
They better be motivated...
I would take this as a HUGE slap in the face if I were them… BTFU! BEAT STATE!!!!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:44 PM EST up reply actions
Today is a happy day.
Even though Gary Harris didn’t commit to Purdue, he’s going somewhere where I’m okay with. Truly the only competitive team that I’m okay with. I would flip if it was OSU, IU, Wisconsin, etc… I know he’s in good hands with Izzo. I hope he’s super successful, just not when we’re playing him.
Don’t forget that we have four 4-star recruits coming in this year to build off of this year and then another good 2013 class. We’re in a great position to make some serious damage. Boiler Up!!!
by Caleb Benner on Nov 9, 2011 8:27 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
This stings, but we can't dwell on it.
Painter is getting some top 100 guys consistantly now. He managed to get 4 straight 25+ win seasons with a handful of top 100 recruits. Imagine what he can do with 2, 3, maybe 4 straight ranked classes. 2013 has the potential to be another 2007 in skill. Bryson Scott is the highest ranked Indiana player in the class, and Kendall Stephens has incredible potential. Smotherman is no slouch either. Add Willis if we land him, and you have a top 10 class easily.
Once Painter proves he can bring Purdue to the late stages of the tournament with these incoming guys, we will land the big 5-star recruits.
That is the key...
I don’t think we will land the * guys until we start producing in the tournaments… BOILER UP! Let’s DO IT!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:47 PM EST up reply actions
The * is supposed to have four others accompanying it...
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:47 PM EST up reply actions
IU's circle jerk over their new recruits
is going to be interesting over the next few years… It’ll be a nice pairing to see if Crean can develop them vs Painter.
Still not afraid of them
I’ve seen Perea and he needs a lot of polish, though he’s extremely athletic. Ferrell can be up and down. Jurkin is a project by their own admission. Hollowell, well, if he was good Lawrence Central would actually be a threat in this state.
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
HammerAndRails, SBNation's Boilermaker Blog
In other words
they are HS players. There are typically only maybe 5 kids a year that go into college that don’t need some significant improvement to be effective at the next level.
I think you mean
Peter Jurkin over their new recruits.
So, there is a definable difference between a top 100 guy and a 5 star.
But in the hands of Matt Painter, players will be developed. Wasn’t Robbie like at #70??? Wasn’t JJ considered to be a bust recruit before coming to Purdue needing way more work than what Painter could supposedly do. Where is he now? I guarantee you hand an 18 year old JJ over to Crean and JaJuan isn’t getting (or going to) paid by the Celtics.
by Caleb Benner on Nov 9, 2011 8:33 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I'm not sure what
that’s based upon. I’m not convinced that Crean can develop players because I haven’t seen it yet…but he did put a handful of players into the NBA at Marquette, and none were top 50 type recruits. He does seem to be better with wings than bigs, at least that’s his history. I’m not sure he ever played a lot of true bigs at Marquette.
Guess we’ll find out with Zeller/Perea, etc….
As far as I recall
Only DWade did anything note worthy in the NBA. That has a lot more to do with him being an NBA all-star level talent than Crean. I may be wrong though. I don’t really look into players outside the Big Ten much once they leave college.
Not sure
think he had like 4 or 5 players at Marquette drafted into the NBA. Diener and Novak come to mind. I never paid much attention either. Like i said, I’m not convinced that he can develop players very well, but I’m not convinced that he can’t either. Guess we’ll find out if he doesn’t get canned before then.
without the DWade years at Marquette, though,
they weren’t that good at all… in either C-USA or the Big East
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:36 PM EST up reply actions
Based on the other Zellers...
I’m not afraid of the one they got…
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:49 PM EST up reply actions
ZING!
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
marq never really had any bigs
lots of shooters and guards who play D but I can’t remember them having a stud big man (i am wearing my 2003 final four shirt right now haha). and ruascott is right about diener and novak making the NBA although they never got much chance to play.
I also think Wesley Matthews is playing for the rockets and doing alright if i remember correctly
Definitely there is...
but then again, what star is Gordan Haywood and Matt Howard?
This might sound stupid....
I think Matty needs to go after 5 stars out of state. There won’t be the pressure from the recruits circle to not go to Purdue.
I see what you're saying...
But if he can’t land guys close to home, I don’t see how traveling across state lines is gonna help. Yes, the recruits won’t have all the pro-IU/anti-Purdue garbage to deal with, but until the team starts to go deeper in the tourney and continues its success, we don’t have much of a sales pitch. If we can’t land an in-state guy, whose parents are both alums, what’s gonna make an outta of state kid want to come to Purdue?
This all comes down to the tournament
Honestly, if I was in his shoes I would have made the same choice. Izzo is Mr. March. There is no recruit in the nation who wouldn’t shrug off a chance to play for him. Painter hasn’t had that kind of success yet. Once he does, we wil lstand a much better chance with 5-star recruits.
Not lately
Last year’s team was full of talent and was a complete bust. I think Izzo gets too much credit at this point.
Last year's talent was his first to underachieve that comes to mind.
Delvon Roe was the first player in a long time I believe that was actually a highly regarded recruit at MSU. Most of what Izzo has been working with are the kind of players we have coming in last year and the next two years. The difference between MSU and Purdue is they get classes like that every year. I think we will notice that Painter will start having a really good team akin to the 2009-10 team soon.
6 Final Fours
Big Ten Titles in 09 and 10. He has past and present success. Its impossible to knock Izzo.
by CoachGreen1 on Nov 10, 2011 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Alot of people around the country probably have a higher opinion of Purdue then people in IN
I have thought this as well. Indiana people in this state do a good job poisoning the well.
Especially with the IU Star only covering IU Sports...
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:51 PM EST up reply actions
Doubt it...
There is no reason to think that Matt Painter will change his recruiting strategy because he missed out on one recruit. He’s doing a pretty, damn good job as is.
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
One recruit?
One recruit? There have been plenty of misses….
I hate MSU
First Dawson now Harris. I don’t care if Harris “did it with class” he’s now the enemy. I can’t wait to watch him get pounded in Mackey next year.
by jwurm09 on Nov 9, 2011 8:35 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
AMEN, Brother!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:52 PM EST up reply actions
I can respect the way he went about handling everything
but to be clear, he IS the enemy now, and I wish him no success against Purdue. That said, good luck at MSU, Gary. You can be 2nd place to us anytime you want. :)
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
Really, you're going to complain about that after the shit being said on twitter?
I have to live in this godforsaken state and listen to Spartan fans every day. Go away.
I would have rather he gone to IU, and no I don't care what any of the rest of you think about that.
Anyone but IU
Had he gone there they would have been completely insufferable.
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
HammerAndRails, SBNation's Boilermaker Blog
No...
It just speaks VOLUMES to the level of douchbaggery coming out of Bloomington.
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:53 PM EST up reply actions
That is so unnecessary
1. I’m the one who called you that, so if you are still holding grudges, be a man and take it on me and not T-Mill. He has nothing to do with it and he sticks up for you all the time.
2. I’ve already publicly apologized to you. If you don’t accept it, that’s fine. But there’s no need to use that to direct it to the innocent bystander.
3. If you say it in the context of the rivalry or as sarcasm or as a semi-joke, I think that is actually totally acceptable. However, you don’t seem to take it too well when I said it, so I’m kinda confused to your double standard.
4. What I refer to as a loser’s mentality is when one wants GH not to go to the rival’s school only b/c one doesn’t feel secure to face the rival school. What T-Mill is referring to (I believe) is the annoying “We got Jesus and we got the #1 recruiting class” before they do anything or win a B1G game.
4a. Having said that, I can understand it’s likely equally annoying (to ppl at Bloomington) if we had gotten GH and many fans here will be calling NC for our Class of 2012 before they won a single game. So we would have been guilty in that regards too. But then again, I don’t think we would ever get the chance to b/c 5* players just don’t come to PU.
This proves it.
I am FAR too emotionally involved with Purdue sports. If I had never gotten twitter or checked these blogs, I would have just read this news tomorrow and said “Huh, that stinks.” But no, I nearly break my hand on the counter top. It’s time to take a step back and look at whats truly important in life.
(said the same thing after the Mizzou saga) (Never gonna happen)
BTFU!!!!
This is far better than the Paitner saga
Had Painter left i think we would have achieved total meltdown
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
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So True
If everyone takes a walk down memory lane, we’d remember how close we were to program apocalypse. We have it really, really damn good right now.
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
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Amen!
I’ was down for a moment but the hand is ok, and we still have a great class coming in! Stars don’t mean a thing once they all step on the court.
by BoilertotheBone on Nov 9, 2011 8:55 PM EST up reply actions
If not for Bernie, it wasn't that close ...
j/k … I agree we should focus on what we have rather than focus on what we have not. That’s Painter’s preaching towards this year’s team too.
This sucks...
Losing Painter would have been TRAGIC, though… like program changing tragic… Harris not committing really isn’t that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things.
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:54 PM EST up reply actions
+100
Couldn’t agree more. I’m still perfectly happy with this recruiting class. I think our future is very bright. The 5* recruits will come. So will the championships. I just hope it’s sooner than later!
Or Scott Martin...
Minus the injuries… don’t wish that on anyone…
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:55 PM EST up reply actions
If he does a Scott Martin
can he transfer to PU?
So in typical Purdue fashion
After we get bad news we usually get some more.
So, what’s it going to be? Matt Painter tore his ACL coaching? Hope signed a 6 year extension? Someone else built a bigger drum?
Patiently waiting for my next dose of bad news.
Dosvidaniya, bitches! BTFU!
by BoilerUpAT on Nov 9, 2011 8:54 PM EST via mobile reply actions
BBD
Bigger BBD literally made me L out L.
Don’t worry, we’ve insured against it by having more drum majors than anyone else….
Your Mom Says Hi
Made me LOL as well...
Thanks UpAT, Needed that.
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
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bigger drum made me laugh so hard
incidentally, a quick google image search for “gigantic drum” gave me this…
To your call once more we rally....
by BoilerPaulie on Nov 9, 2011 10:47 PM EST up reply actions
Let's get a national championship before Harris gets one...
then I will be satisfied.
Site Manager at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
Yeah that sure won't happen.
On paper (cuz lets be honest this is all fantasy until it actually happens) Izzo has assembled one of his best teams. The 2013 season could potentially feature four five stars, seven four stars and two three stars. Not a bad team. In fact, in terms of recruiting rankings and raw talent the only team I can think of that competes of MSU’s is the 05 team with Anderson, Ager, Davis, Brown, Neitzel, etc.
And yet the 2000 team
won a championship, not the 2005 team….
Let's get a freaking National Championship
PERIOD
F Gary Harris
by Boiler_Ditsor on Nov 9, 2011 9:00 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Normally im irrational as you can get
but we going to be fine. We stock back up in 13. If Willis puts a muzzle on his dad, he could end up back here. It’s not even close to the painter saga.
Ledge goes step back. Or give me all your things. Either works.
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Nothing to stop back up with
We still have a hell of a team next season with the four guys coming in and with who remains.
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by BoilerTMill on Nov 9, 2011 9:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Revenge
Listen ya i agree that Gary Harris did the whole recruiting process the right way but he didn’t pick us so that makes him our enemy. I want to beat the living hell out of him every time we play him. I want him to realize that he missed on a great oppurtunity. Goin on from that I understand most of you are happy about our 2012 class but honestly I’m not sold. Davis is a 3 star on every site except espn and so is Hammons. Simpson is a 3 star and johnson is the only one who has a 4 star at every site. Now how can a shitty Michigan program of late get the one of the best players in the country and be number 5 in recruiting and IU after being a laughing stock of the big ten out recruit us. There is a problem when you cant grab a 5 star whos parents went to your school, you played with and our close with all the recruits, and its close to home. Idk but there has to be someone fishy with Izzo….Y was Izzo suspended one game last year…DAWSON
Dont sell Davis short
He’s a pitbull. CK3 2.0 hopefully. Having size in the post like Hammons and Simpson will do wonders for the outside shooting we have coming in 2013.
Football recruiting guy for Hammer and Rails
Lead blogger for 5 other sites.
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by HawkeyeBoiler on Nov 9, 2011 9:11 PM EST up reply actions
Why Davis is ranked lower than Harris?
It seems that they play a similar position and Davis is a much better scorer than Harris (although not as athletic). I just hope when they face off next year Davis totally outshines Harris.
I see where you are coming from
and tend to agree to some extent. As much as it sucked for RH to be gone last year, it will help bridge the program to the future classes. But the reality is that there is going to be somewhat of a drop off over the next couple of years vs the previous several.
The ‘12 class is very solid, and will be a foundation for moving forward. None of them are going to come in and win games as freshman without some other support that I just don’t see being there.
Now looking forward to ’13 and beyond, as they mature the program should be in good shape. GH was really the only recruit that could have come in and helped keep the program at the level people have become accustomed to, without there being much of a dip.
A little disappointing...
but still excited for the future. If Willis recommits this will be pretty easy to forget. Even if he doesn’t Painter is doing a heck of a job.
The thing w/Willis is ...
that there is no scholarship for 2013. For 2012, at least we could have thought John Hart may graduate and leave a spot for GH. In 2013, we are already at the limit now.
willis is not coming
people need to move on from that.
Even if Harris had committed...
we would have been one over in both 2012 and 2013!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 9:59 PM EST up reply actions
Trust me on this
Where or not there us actually room for Willis will not stop Painter from recruiting him. He’l make room. Although I don’t disagree that we should mentally move on from him. We need to heal before we get involved again.
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by Purdue_Pete on Nov 10, 2011 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
Fast forward to next season
I hope Painter puts Barlow on Harris and he just shuts him down. And I don’t mean just stop him from scoring. I mean complete frustration, mental breakdown from all the trash talking and antics Barlow pulls. Then I might be ok with all of this
by Boiler12 on Nov 9, 2011 9:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Haha
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
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Next year, it'll be Lawson ;-)
Lawson blocking every shot that Dawson tries to put up, and out-rebound Dawson leaving Dawson fouling out in frustratoin
Took the easy way out IMO
Chose a school out of state where he will have less pressure. Choosing MSU over PU and IU means he doesn’t hurt anyones feelings, he wouldn’t have to deal with the fallout of choosing PU over IU or vice-versa, he’s going into a whole new territory, he’s not “joining the movement”, he’s not going where his parents went. He handled the recruiting very well, but I’m not surprised he went up to sparty country. I just feel it was an easier decision than his family and we all made it out to be.
I think Willis just enjoys the attention
a week after de-committing he was talking about what his top 5 schools were, as if he would even have had time to check them out yet. I doubt he comes back.
No doubt about the attention thing
I mean, just look at his father. He acts like its him who’s getting recruited.
Maybe we can put this one on Hope too ;-)
Rumors has it that after seeing Purdue get trashed by ND, GH decided no way he would come to WL.
Sorry, just need to find someone to yell at, and I don’t feel Painter, Harris or Izzo deserves my yelling.
Don't Understand
How do you not get a local player with alumns as parents? Additionally, how do you not go after Glenn Robinson III, figure that would also be a given?!
Me neither...
Brian Cardinal has a son, right? If he is a quality player and we don’t even get him then that’s sth seriously wrong!
They didnt pressure him
His parents said they didnt want to make it seem like he had to go to purdue and we did recruit GBlll but he didnt seem to want to be in his dads shadow and he was barely a top 100 recruit when he choose michigan
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
guys guys
I think this fundamentally came down to Scholarships.
We didnt have room for him
IU didnt have room for him
Kentucky had room, but he knew no one there.
MSU had room, was close(ish) and wins.
That's pretty much what I thought yesterday
He seems like the kind of kid who wouldn’t want to force someone out off the team
I don't buy this
Maybe for IU who are waaaay oversigned, but shouldn’t be Purdue.
My question
What is it about Izzo that he can just steal IN recruits from us year after year? I mean, assuming he isn’t doing anything illegal (and unless there are strong evidence I give Izzo the benefit of doubts … extraordinary claim requires extraordinary evidence), then what is it that he is doing that we aren’t?
Sure, he has the “every 4-year player goes to at least a FF” in his resume. But he doesn’t start out that way, right? It isn’t like he started out with an entire class of 5*, got to the FF and just the momentum just carried him for over a decade.
When we got beaten, the most important thing is to learn how we got beat. What can we learn from our opponent so that we can do it better the next time?
Is it Painter? Is it the Purdue system? Any insight?
It's just Purdue.....
I love Purdue, but in regards to sports, we just aren’t up there. I was going to go to Ohio State solely due to the sports administration so I could work in there and get a sports management degree. Purdue just is so high on academics (which is obviously #1 priority) but our sports lags behind soooo much. Look at these other B1G schools who are ranked ahead of us or right around us academically, but are so much more sports oriented.
I believe he actually got a National Title very early in his MSU tenure.
Mind you had had three studs on that team, but he had success very early in his career. Once you start getting far in the tournament players are naturally drawn to play for you. We just need to give Painter a bit more time to get a truely talented roster to get to that level. I love the guys we currently have, but they aren’t the material you can win late in the tournament with if you have to rely on them.
We never had the depth so far to compete if one great player had an injury or off night. 2012 is a start. 2013 we have some very good recruits that people seem to be over looking. Painter in two years will have the most talented and deepest roster he has had yet.
More than three studs
Cleaves, Peterson, Bell, Granger, Hutson, Richardson and Chappell. Quite the lineup when you think about it. Izzo really got extremely lucky that the Fab Five scandal happened, because while he had made huge in-roads, he grew to dominate one of the most basketball centric states in America. No Indiana high school scene but still. And now he’s finally expanding to a national recruiter, something he was turned off of after the Zach Richardson one and done thing.
And note that he prefers to throw in some low four stars and three stars like Brandon Kearney or Travis Trice, players he can develop and mold to his system, it’s not all glitz (not that anyones saying it is).
Now that we have Dane Fife
Its only gonna get easier for Izzo to pluck Indiana recruits. Michigan has dried up for elite talent and he needs to expand his core area.
For Christ's sake
We don’t even have a Sports Management/Marketing degree……pretty sure all other B1G schools have one…..BALL STATE AND INDIANA STATE EVEN HAS ONE LOL
heard that.
definitely wish they had that. instead i am gonna go into management and look for graduate school in sports administration
"The goal remains the same"
by TimeToPlayHard on Nov 9, 2011 10:03 PM EST up reply actions
Hey...it depends who you listen to...
Do you remember where we were with this class two years ago? We had Davis, Molock and Simpson, while the rest of the world was loading up on studs. Hammons and AJ are improvements, but this class was never billed to be a world beater class.
what a smuck
i hope he ends up like oden….final 4 as a freshman, go to nba, career ending injury.
what a smuck
W. Morton
You shouldn't wish an injury on anyone
regardless of the circumstances
Come on now
We’re better than this. let’s act like it.
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
HammerAndRails, SBNation's Boilermaker Blog
actuallly.....
anyone that leaves state (and more than likely took $$$ in the meantime), deserves a good old fashioned acl injury..
i hope he tears it this year and is a complete flop.
W. Morton
It would be much sweeter
if Harris excelled in East Lansing and we STILL kicked their butts.
"There's no hope until Hope is gone!"
x2
Sweetest if we beat MSU to deny them a chance to dance while we win our first NC. Even better if Lawson shuts down Dawson and Davis shuts down Harris in that game.
Let 'em dance
Then we’d have 4 chances to whup ’em in a season.
"There's no hope until Hope is gone!"
OK
Then beat them at EE. Just don’t wanna have them at FF and later use it as a marketing tool.
TMill mis-spoke
Let’s try, “We should be” better than that.
I believe in painter
It started way back in January of 08 when he kicked my bivy sack one cold morning and offered me some joe and a donut.
I agree with Tmill. Its not the end of the world. If paintergate has gone south we would have a reason to freak….now football is another story…hope is no painter
by boilerrx on Nov 9, 2011 9:58 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
Meanwhile, paterno reportedly out for good now
Whatt else is going on?
A futile crusade to prevent mass ignorance
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message to bob kravitz
Please note number of posts, and rabid nature of fans….
You suck.
That is all.
by boilerrx on Nov 9, 2011 10:08 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
Hey guys,
Say a prayer for those in State College tonight. It’s going to be a mad house, and if someone gets hurt from the riots, this is just going to get worse.
What could you possibly riot about?
This is one of those rare highly controversial situations that I have no idea how to feel about. There are no winners – only losers.
Go home, lick your wounds and return Penn State to an institution of which you can all be unqualifyingly proud.
The fact that Paterno is fired and yet Curley is still on leave.
Poor, poor decision. Joe needed to go, but PSU loves him regardless. Campus was on fire last night. Can’t imagine Beaver Ave. right now…
by Caleb Benner on Nov 9, 2011 10:24 PM EST up reply actions
So how are we going to stack up against other big ten teams?
Many of them are getting/have big time players.
The same way Painter has before
Development and scrappy defense. I do expect us to have a bit of a let down this and next year, but by 2013-2014 we will be back to chasing for top seeds in the tournament (and hopefully national championships).
The great news about that is
the style that Purdue plays means that we will rarely be outclassed in any 1 game. Star players come through other programs constantly but step onto the floor in mackey and we lock them down as a team.
Ha! That's a valid point
I take solace in the fact that I said “in Mackey”.
Also, perhaps my memory is short on this but in all of our tournament “outs” I don’t recall the opponent’s star absolutely going off. Singler 2 years ago had like 25 and maybe Paul Pierce from Kansas years ago but we get beat many times by a team’s, ummm, supplemental players. (cough, Keaton Nankivil, cough)
VCU?
Their whole TEAM went off!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 10:57 PM EST up reply actions
First of all
I had successfully blocked out that memory.
2nd of all, I wouldn’t necessarily call Bradley Fucking Burgess a “star”.
Seriously, I remember all the way back to when I had season tix back in the Big Dog days. Teams would come in with Chris Webber, Steve Smith or Calbert Cheaney and would leave with scratches, scars, bite marks and a significantly lower scoring average.
It’s the Purdue way. Dawson and GH will leave with those same scars.
by VegasBaby on Nov 9, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Purdue's weakness these past two years
has been “that random player”.
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Senior All-American Alto Sax
I find it strange..
Every team that beats us goes to a Final Four. We are like a good luck charm.
Exactly!
When we 3-peat in the 90s, we never have any 5* (except one year with Big Dog). It’s always from a bunch of overachieving upper classmen playing hard-nose defense. If Butler can get to two NC games w/o any 5* recruit, there is no reason to limit how far we can go.
That's new
Harris isn’t any better than a lot of other recruits Izzo has had
I think the train double entendre was lost on them
15 year old vs MSU students.
No match.
Was it really a double entendre?
I’m not sure that’s what it was
Not Surprised
I’m not surprised that GH is going to MSU. It’s not just the Final Fours -the most recent was a buzzer beater away from not happening. It’s everything else, such as the Carrier Classic and games against traditional powers. Izzo can sell the excitement of MSU games from November to April. Now, look at our nonconference schedule – are there any opponents you see that make you really, really excited?
I’m really curious what guys like Ronnie Johnson are hearing from Harris after his decision.
by Bryan Kennedy on Nov 9, 2011 10:25 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
St. Johns
I think we should start an annual series with St. Johns. Call it the Keady Cup.
St. Johns isn’t the most exciting team in the nation, but could start another great rivalry Purdue can build up. St. Johns is on the rise, and having exciting non-Big 10 games consistently on our schedule could help lure top prospects.
by Bryan Kennedy on Nov 9, 2011 10:51 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
The West Virginia series was a fun one...
I’d like to do that again!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
Becareful who you call an enemy
I’ve seen the word enemy being thrown around a lot since the Harris thing came out. I’m a Purdue alum and in the Navy and I can tell you all, that high school kids and other schools are not the enemy. Sure I want to beat our rivals but lets not lose sight at what all this is but simply a game. Fellow Hoosiers are not my enemy, fellow conference members are not my enemy. There are people and places out there beyond our boarders and I can tell you they don’t care about Gary Harris. I wish he would of went to Purdue but oh well. Let’s not lose sight of what’s really important to us.
Anthony Johnson!!!!
Guys chill. Would have been nice to get Harris but AJ is totally legit and will light it up. Throw in TJ, RD, and we are already stacked at the 2. Add Smotherman and Stephens on the wing in 13 and we stay deep and talented there. I gotta think that PT affected GH’s decision because we have so much talent at the 2 already, with more coming. Much easier for him to get PT @ MSU.
Yeah, I'm VERY excited about AJ!
I think he can make me forget about GH
Anthony Johnson is good...
Still needs to get stronger… Everyone will benefit from Ronnie Johnson dropping dimes as well next year! Plus, he is a scoring threat as well!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 9, 2011 11:01 PM EST reply actions
Ronnie can shoot.
As an NC grad, I can say I’ve watched him play a lot. He’s good.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 10, 2011 12:25 AM EST up reply actions
JOHN HART!
Since your scholarship for 2012 appears to be safe, now pls come back from surgery and be the player we saw you in the Illinois game!!
11/11/11
MSU has the carrier classic on the CARL VINSON vs. UNC
Magic, James Worthy, and POTUS will attend.
Purdue has Northern Illinois for the Mackey rededication game.
nuff said.
Home and Home
Purdue wanted to get a big name team to come in and play at Mackey this year and Purdue would return the trip next year. Several schools turned us down, most notably UCLA, because no one wants to play non-conference road games. UCLA should have been a lock for this game. John Wooden’s UCLA team, led by, Lew Alcindor (AKA Kareem Abdul-Jabar) came out to play in the first ever game in Mackey. They should have come back again at least to honor the late John Wooden.
I do think we need to up our schedule, especially years in which we think we are going to be very good. On the other hand an easier schedule allows a team with several question marks a chance to answer a lot of those questions and gain confidence. I think these early season beat downs that MSU is going to receive from UNC and Duke are going to mess with their confidence. Last year MSU really struggled and non-conf and then fell apart in the BigTen.
Some of this is unbelievable.
I’m shocked an appalled by the reactions of some of our fans.
Think about these points:
1. Matt Painter just renegotiated his contract to include resources that match every other big-time coach. He now has top-tier facilities that analysts are saying are some of the very best in the nation.
2. It takes time to build. Think 2-3 years down the road, not next year. That is a stacked team that could rival, no, TOP the dominating performance of the 09-10 Boilers. We were ranked 3rd nationally and in line for a 1 seed before Hummel got hurt!
3. As much as it stings, Harris is ONE PLAYER. We’re stacked at SG even without him. I trust Matt Painter…the guy knows what he’s doing.
4. Some of the people on this board refuse to see reason and think we’re doomed to failure. That simply isn’t true. Matt Painter is the first coach at Purdue to ever demand championship resources.
Just wait, folks. Our time is coming.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 9, 2011 11:06 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Ummm....
TJ, AJ, Kendall, Basil, Raphael can all play shooting guard. AJ looks really good offensively. I just hope he develops on the other end of the court. Stacked? At least very solid.
But, on another note…I wasn’t gonna drink tonight….
I'd say there's a lot of potential there...
We need these guys to develop tho.
Youre right
but guess what harris hasnt played a minute at msu, he has to develop too. Yeah they are predicting that he will but how often are they wrong? He could be a complete bust. His high ranking has a lot to do with his freakish athleticism. I think if he was so good he might have lead his high school team to a regional title last year but instead North central won it with ronnie johnson at point. Your negativity with little to no facts for your argument is getting very old.
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
What facts am I missing?
Are you saying Ronnie is better than Harris? You could be correct, but that’d be a minority view. If it makes things better, I think Harris is more likely to bust at MSU then at Purdue. However, maybe Harris knew deep inside that he doesn’t like tough coaches and prefers the stroking that he would get from Izzo. What was it he said…“I think Izzo will get it out of me….?” Obviously he knows better than we do.
With respect to my negativity, I’m just trying to question some assumptions around here to figure out why my hopes keep getting dashed. Throwing some stuff out there and we’ll see what sticks.
Well you asked about SG's
Purdue has 5 or 6 maybe even 7 people on the roster the next couple of years who either are or can play SG. To me that is stacked at the position considering it is roughly half of the teams scholarships. Also i wasnt saying ronnie is or isnt better than gary just that he seems to make those around him better and basketball outside of the nba is a team sport.
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
It sucks but it makes sense
We’re kind of loaded at his position and MSU isn’t.
We got Hammons and we still have Painter.
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Senior All-American Alto Sax
Plus
Izzo and MSU were there as long as anyone. From comments by GH about his committment, it seems like the fact that Izzo was there since his freshman year seemed to be the deciding factor. Being loyal to Izzo for that isn’t something we can blame him for.
The only thing to take away from this is that Purdue is far less desirable than MSU
We have one instance where we lost a guy we were in early on, and another case where we lost a legacy we were in late on. Different circumstances, same result.
Although with Harris, maybe we ruffled some feathers by taking Davis so early. It took us out of the game for Harris and alot of other guys.
I don’t know. Just looking forward to a UNC blowout on Friday night. Pierce the veil I say.
Didnt the Dawson family
state that talking with Painter and staff was painfully boring? The whole thing with GH stating he felt more love in MSU makes me think there is something a bit off with our staff, maybe a little too stiff.
Never heard that...
but that seems plausible. Painter is a bit of a hard ass, maybe needs to learn how to soften up his approach for some of these guys. Who knows….
I’ve been in business and sales and relationship building for a while, and I’ve learned a few things over the years. Seems like there could be a personality clash going on
Hard Ass???
One of Painter’s best and worst traits is that he is brutally honest. If someone on the bench is outplaying you, you’re probably going to be on the bench pretty soon. That’s his style and I respect it.
As for a softer approach, I wonder what Bobby Knight did for recruiting? Promise that he wouldn’t choke them? Kids today are somewhat soft.
by Bryan Kennedy on Nov 9, 2011 11:53 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
That's my point..
IMO – Painter idolized Knight. Knight was brutally honest. Being brutally honest will not win you many friends. I know this for a fact.
Salesmen are not brutally honest. However, Salesmen are also not “molders of men”. That’s the trade off. Salesmen like Crean can get the talent, but it lies fallow. Painter can grow the talent, but it’s hard to come by. It’s a rare bird which can do both.
Izzo has a bit of both, without question.
Izzo's charm > Painter's charm
They’ have completely different styles, and Painter’s fits Indiana basketball.
by Bloomington.Boiler on Nov 10, 2011 9:25 AM EST up reply actions
Painter doesn't use many loaded words
And a lot of people expect to hear them.
I think I’ve bored a lot of people who expect me to be very excited about the latest thing they’re complaining about. And I’m glad of that.
Painter doesn’t necessarily have that luxury. Some people find straight talk boring. I imagine it’s a huge dilemma when to turn the salesmanship on when your job performance may depend on recruiting a certain player who wants to see that flash…but I remember a quote of Gene Keady’s (I think) about Painter being a player’s coach and a coach’s coach, while Bruce Weber was more a coach’s coach.
So I think we’re doing all right. And I also think that when people call someone boring, more often than not they have something else they don’t like about that person they can’t express.
Painter seems anything but stiff on the sidelines. But I also don’t think he goes around showing emotion for its own sake. I mean, in post-game press conferences, I don’t think he’s ever been omg-quotable. But I usually get a lot from it when I listen carefully.
In conclusion, I suspect Painter knows he’d clash with anyone who finds his natural self boring, and he understands it’s not worthwhile to press that.
by Beavis Beefcake on Nov 10, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
Problem I see
It’s just that these are 16-18 year olds. They have big dreams and want to get excited, not bored by teacher.
In a way, we've been recruiting Harris from birth.
Besides, didn’t Brian say that that aspect of the recruitment was water under the bridge now? All the sudden today, he’s back to saying Izzo was there first. I think it’s more of a personality contrast between Painter and Izzo
The funny thing is tho that maybe the personality aspect makes Painter who he is as a coach.
I don't see it that way myself
I really think both will play at least 2 seasons. The one wild card is that I do believe Izzo wants to coach in the NBA and will get the offer he’s looking for within the next few years.
I think that window has closed. I think he wants a cush job so he can enjoy retirement
I think he has 4 years left.
I’m not sure Dawson will be able to hack it that long up there, that far from home. Alot of bad influences at that school. Alot of weed and alot of blow.
As much as I respect Izzo and what he has done I agree.
MSU seems to have a lot of poor traits among the athletes. You have things like bar fights, DUI’s, drugs, etc seemingly happening every year.
I used to live in Detroit.
I know alot of MSU people. They aren’t saints, suffice it to say. That school parties very hard. Much different from Purdue, and Purdue parties hard. Just a totally different atmosphere. There is a Detroit element that takes it to the next level.
dude..as a MSU alum..living in Detroit qualifies you as a MSU expert.
stop it. The campus is beautiful and it is 85 miles from Detroit in East Lansing.
by spartynation on Nov 10, 2011 1:22 AM EST up reply actions
Actually...
I have had that feeling that Dawson may not stay at MSU his entire career too, but my idea was more towards Izzo leaving.
And I don’t think Izzo will turn down millions of dollars for 3-4 years or so to coach a few years. He’s extremely competitive and loves new challenges.
But, yeah, MSU does have issues at times, indeed.
bstirrat
You have no facts behind your nasty pessimism. I wish you would take some time to reflect and realize that…down the road…we’re just getting started.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 9, 2011 11:27 PM EST reply actions
bstirrat
You have no facts behind your nasty pessimism. I wish you would take some time to reflect and realize that…down the road…we’re just getting started.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 9, 2011 11:28 PM EST reply actions
You're right....
I’m just a fan. But I have the same facts everyone else on here has. I can watch the vids, read the scouting reports, read the boards, just like everyone. Look, I love our 2013 class, I think those guys will get it done. I have never been a fan of the 2012 class tho, except for Ronnie Johnson. I don’t think it’s a bad class. I think it’s better than our last 2 classes, I’m just tired of having my hopes dashed. I’m sure you are too.
I need to vent, it’s the only way to make me get over this
You sound like you're giving up on Purdue basketball.
3 or 4 years down the road, you’re going to regret those words.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 9, 2011 11:55 PM EST up reply actions
I haven't given up, no way
I just wanted us to win this one, and I’m pissed that we didn’t.
That's good to hear.
I understand that Purdue fans are venting, but people need to back off the ledge.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 10, 2011 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
I understand
that we have good recruits coming in, which with Painters help will probably be really good after a few years, but it would be nice to have an instant player that could take the game over and we wouldnt have to wait for him to develop. We waited for the big three to develop and look at the bumps in the road that happened. Also, I am hoping that from now our recruits each year will be potentials… as it seemed that after we got RH, EM & JJ our recruiting took a dump and we never got any major players to help them, when that would have been the prime time to motivate someone to come in…
OK, I've counted to ten (thousand)
I’m in about the third stage of grieving. This one hurts. I really thought he’d be a Boiler for a lot of reasons that made sense to me but obviously not to him. And don’t kid yourself, he would have been a hell of a player for us. But there is one thing that a couple of you have touched on that softens the blow. In the back of my mind, I always felt that if we got GH, that eventually we would probably lose one of our other wings. Basil or KS could have decommitted or even TJ may have transfered. I just don’t think there would have been enough minutes for everyone. Don’t think we’ll have to worry about that now.
by Hummel's figurines on Nov 9, 2011 11:40 PM EST reply actions
Really
Really you can’t hang on this too long. What has hurt us in the past few seasons is a lack of depth. The recruiting classes after the Baby Boilers were not really close to what we have coming the next couple years, and hopefully beyond. With these classes coming in we will be very deep and talented, at all of the positions.
Painter is building something very, very good, but it will take a bit of time. I truly think the achievements of this team the next few years will allow him to take his recruiting and the program to the level he, and we, want it to be.
THANK YOU
Some of the idiots on this board fail to see the big picture. Painter is building for something huge with the resources he now has.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 9, 2011 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
Pashion
Take away all the talent, and what you are left with are 4 new players that have the passion to get pushed to the limits and become Boilermakers. And I’m assuming the desire to pummel IU any chance they get.
by Bryan Kennedy on Nov 9, 2011 11:58 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Yessir
My point is that some of the people here are blindly angry. I had a gut feeling he would choose MSU. We aren’t lost…2013 is sick and I can only imagine what Painter will do with 2014. You have to think of a team with 2007 level talent stacked together. That is SICK.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 10, 2011 12:01 AM EST up reply actions
Passion
Damn I must have been tired…
by Bryan Kennedy on Nov 10, 2011 5:41 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Just Disappointed
I’m really happy with our class, it replaces what we lost and one big bonus player plus.
Player loss 2011
Hummel, Jackson, Smith
Replacement Players
Simpson, Johnson, Davis,
Bonus Player
AJ Hammons
I’m just disappointed with Purdue’s targetting and recruiting of Purdue kids. Gary Harris Mom was Purdue athlete, Glen Robinson’s kid we didn’t even try for, Both in state and highly rated. How do we miss on these? At least in 2013 we locked down Kendall Stephens.
Ignorance can be fixed. Stupidity is forever.
Haven't "locked" down anyone for 2013....
A verbal is far from “locking down.” Granted i think they will all come here, but crazy stuff can happen
They all seem like good kids with good families.
They all talked about getting recruiting out of the way and focusing on getting better to succeed at Purdue. They weren’t like Willis who got recruited and jumped ship the moment he heard he was a good prospect.
Wrong
We did recruit GBlll but he had said he was wary of being in his dads shadow and committed to michigan shortly after Purdue showed interest. Also he was barely inside the top 100 of recruits when he committed no one was talking about it as that big of a get.
by jack'sIUdisdain on Nov 10, 2011 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
Purdue just isn't desirable......yet
As a student and seeing the type of people that go here and Purdue’s fanbase. We aren’t going to appeal to high recruits. Shoot, sports wise, Purdue didn’t even appeal to me (I’m diehard as they come), but Ohio State was my 2nd choice for school because of the athletics. Their programs and administration are tops in the country (Insert comment about Tressel here), but Purdue sports is just plain….
If everyone was like us on this site, it'd be different
That’s what I’m ultimately trying to say. Our academics is our #1 priority, wayyyyyyy above sports. Which it should be, but I’d like to see more balance
^This so much
For the life of me, I can’t explain why there are so many people at Purdue who think you can’t be good academically and with sports at the same time. There are even people who post on this site with the mentality that as long as we have good academics, they don’t really care if we can compete. Someone clearly forgot to tell Michigan, UCLA, etc that good academics means you have to suck at sports.
Yeah it doesn't make sense
Duke and Stanford missed the memo, as well.
Reaction images? I got 'em
Senior All-American Alto Sax
Let's not too much emphasis on stars
Derrick Williams was a pretty much run of the mill 3/4 star recruit that no one really thought would turn into a game changer. Two years later he was the #2 pick in the NBA draft.
To me this says a lot more about the current perception of the program with the “elite” kids. If we can’t lockup an instate dual legacy that’d be the #1 option immediately, then whether anyone likes it or not we’ve got a problem. The easiest and fastest way to change our standing among the top recruits, besides buying Rick Ray back, is just win games.
And I have absolutely no doubt in my mind we will continue winning a shit load of games.
Sup Jello Shot?
IndyPacers-
You contradicted yourself. If a 3/4 star guy can be a top NBA draft pick, then the players we have signed aren’t something to complain about. We missed on Harris…but we’re going to hit it big in a few years. Think down the road and the resources Painter now has.
by Jackson Brunner on Nov 10, 2011 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
That's what I'm saying
We can keep pulling in the classes full of 4 stars we have been and be more than fine. But if we’re going where we all want, which is banners, you NEED elite recruits. I wish I could remember who tweeted it today, well last night now, either Snow or Telep I believe, but (not sure of the time frame referenced) the rosters of past national champs averaged just under 8 top 100 guys and 3 top 25 guys.
Sup Jello Shot?
Include national runners up
Like Butler, and that drops. I’d guess.
At this point I’d be interested in the average stars of Final 4 teams as well as standard deviations in # of stars, if we want to look at that. I really do think the final 4 is the first step, and I also think that if Painter’s track record of developing players is good, we don’t need quite as many 5-star guys. I’m also a bit suspicious of how 4- and 5-star rankings adjust when players go to certain school. No stats there though.
So I don’t think stars are everything. I mean, you made that argument, too. But I’d be interested in seeing the correlation between average stars and tournament progress as something more robust.
I have to say we don’t seem to have as much space for Gary Harris as MSU does, and I didn’t guess we had any chance a few months ago.
Given what I know (specious) I’d say that having a choice between getting either Hammons for sure and (both or neither of Hammons/Harris) I’d have settled for “just” Hammons like that.
Not to say I don’t want us signing a 5-star. But I think this class is a really good sign even though the coaching staff has been shuffled around a bit. Perhaps the shuffle helped.
by Beavis Beefcake on Nov 10, 2011 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
I remember getting quizzical looks for considering a new major
Or wanting to try something different in college. Something that didn’t pay as well, had less prestige, and was, apparently, easier. Apparently I was, in some way, throwing away the education or hard work people’d put into me…
…no, not everyone said that. It was just a few people, and I magnified them. But I know what it’s like to go against the obvious choice. Or one people think is obvious.
I also know what it’s like to feel guilt tripped into the “right/safe” choice because I couldn’t pacify the concern trolls (or what I imagined their arguments were) enough. Or I didn’t quite have all the answers yet.
Gary Harris will face similar stuff from people who don’t know him, now that he’s announced (maybe he already has on twitter!) I hope he learns to deal with them swiftly and decently, and I suspect he already partially has.
by Beavis Beefcake on Nov 10, 2011 12:47 AM EST reply actions
Hey everyone
Now that I have your attention, check out this slick pass from RJ.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUTP_gDEv4o&feature=player_embedded#t=70s
#movingonaftertheharrisdisappointment
Reaction images? I got 'em
Senior All-American Alto Sax
BEERRRRRR
Drink UP! ya we didn’t get Harris but still we are a top academic school in the country and we all love goin here! Sports isnt everything BTFU!
Where do they display that "We Love Goin Here" championship trophy at on campus?
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Nov 10, 2011 8:12 AM EST up reply actions
Obviously just a replica....
…sold at University Spirit.
Nobody cares about your fantasy baseball team
by carmen_fanzone on Nov 10, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
It's called a diploma!
And it is worth EVERY penny!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 10, 2011 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
It's too bad our campus didn't riot over Harris
That would have really made for an entertaining night of ESPN. Dueling riots.
Dawson and Harris -
Painter and crew are coming for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by boilerbacker31 on Nov 10, 2011 8:16 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
If we have to blame someone
It’s best to blame Danny Hope!
by Bloomington.Boiler on Nov 10, 2011 9:35 AM EST up reply actions
Something to keep in mind
I know that everyone is wanting these top recruits right away, but consider for a moment that our 2013 class is already squared away. As long as no one de-commits, we’re in maintenance mode for that class. That means that Painter and company can turn all of their attention to the 2014 and beyond classes, something not many other schools can say. Gotta believe that gives us an edge for the future.
Adding on....
It’s pretty disheartening to see people dogging on this recruiting class. I was EXTREMELY excited the day we got a commitment from Hammons. When was the last time we had a true center? I can’t wait to see a 7 foot big man out there in a Purdue uniform. I loved JJ to death, and will him terribly, but there were games where we needed a banger down low, and that just wasn’t his thing. Hammons will bring that to the table. Can you imagine it? Purdue consistently on the plus side of the rebounding differential? That should get you excited Boiler Nation.
by AAMB Boiler on Nov 10, 2011 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
*will miss him terribly
I really need to proofread before I post…
by AAMB Boiler on Nov 10, 2011 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
What's with all the new names on here being negative
Most of the people in this thread saying that the sky is falling and
2012 CLASS SUX WITHOUT GH 1
are people I’ve never seen comment too much. Did you guys sign up to just come and bitch and moan?
Boiler Up. Hammer Down.
Amen, Brother!
Boiler Up! Hammer Down!
by JuJuan some Moore? on Nov 10, 2011 5:48 PM EST up reply actions
Harris
I keep hearing now that the coach of Gary Harris confirmed that it was between IU and MSU. Have you guys heard anything about this?
I read that...
I don’t believe it for a second.Whether or not he is tell people that is another thing altogether. But to me, it’s an attempt to save face to the majority of Indiana (and preserve his chances to win Mr. Basketball).
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
That's pretty dishonest if so.
If they were so interested in “doing things the right way”, then why start having the coach lie to protect your image?
Seems kinda twisted for a “straight shooting” family.
Unfortunately we’ll never ‘officially’ know. So for all intents and purposes, we lost all ground to claim it was down to MSU and Purdue. Oh well…another year another recruit…
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
True
I can’t see this being true. Do you guys know who reported the other way around, which was Purdue/MSU?
I know it doesn’t matter now, I just want the true story.
Jeff Washburn
Reported it before and he still stands by that after the commit too.
It was pretty predominant rumor
I mean you aren’t going to get document validation that it was accurate, but these things tend to get reported correctly… Peegs even said in a chat that GH told him during his visit that he was playing from behind.
- Contributor/Editor/ All-around embarrassment at Hammer & Rails
- Follow my unintelligible musings at: @PurdueBBall
Thanks
Thanks for the answers, love the site. My friends and I made the same joke as a poster above, that it was Danny Hope’s fault. Being in the stands for the ND game can’t make you happy about the school, no matter how awesome we all know it is.
Contrast the ND @ Purdue football game
With the prime-time, ESPN on campus, won by a walk-off hail mary Wisc @ MSU football game that GH attended on his MSU visit. Definitely a different atmosphere, and I gotta think being at that game was beneficial to MSU’s recruitment of him. It surely didn’t hurt.
by MSUDersh on Nov 10, 2011 9:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
LOL oops you're right, my bad
I got him screwed up with the huge group of football recruits that were at MSU for the Wisky game. But hey, wins are wins!
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